Harry's Relationships with Lupin and Sirius

Ok, so I know that many people have discussed Lupin's supposed lack of emotion over Sirius' death (and his lack of any real character development in this book), but what I was curious about in this book was more Lupin's overall relationship with Harry.

In The Prisoner of Azkaban, Harry and Lupin seemed extremely friendly. Harry seemed to look up to Lupin quite a bit and have some kind of real relationship with him. In the Order of the Phoenix, however, Harry and Lupin seem very distant. Almost as if, now that Sirius is in Harry's life, Lupin thinks he has to back off. I don't like that. I definately think Harry needs as many close relationships as possible. I hope now, Lupin will become close again with Harry considering the loss affects them both greatly, but I just dislike the lack of closeness in the 5th book.

On the same kind of topic (forgive me if this has been discussed) but did the virtually complete lack of affection bother anyone else? I mean between Harry and Sirius, Harry and Lupin, etc., etc. Harry could have used a hug or two from an adult other than Mrs. Weasley, in my opinion.

No no, this is fine. I asked this question nearly immedietly after finishing the book. I will be sorely disappointed if Lupin doesn't try to get closer to Harry now that Sirius is gone. Not take his place, but... you know, step up to the plate and accept the responsibility to his friends' child and godson. I think it is on his shoulders now, and if he doesn't do anything about it, it will be a slander even I do not utter against Lupin.

I also noticed Lupin seemed to back off from Harry, even though Harry rather enthusiastically talked to him when he could. Hm.

-Siri

~Bitterness: Never be afraid to share your dreams with the world, because there's nothing the world loves more than the taste of really sweet dreams~

Part of the Elite Confused Duo

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I also noticed Lupin seemed to back off from Harry, even though Harry rather enthusiastically talked to him when he could. Hm.

I noticed that too, i wonder if Lupin knows something that we have yet to figure out or find out <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START blue paw

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did the virtually complete lack of affection bother anyone else?

YES!! I'm so glad someone mentioned it! I was SO expecting Harry to hug Lupin when he was rescued from the dursleys. But then he didn't, and I was like "No? um... alright", and then it happened a bunch of other times with both Sirius and Lupin, but they kept frickin' shaking hands! I was frustated beyond belief... probably more than most people, but I wanted Harry to hug someone, darnit!- he's had little to no love in his life, and now that he had a father figure, and I dunno, I guess I'd call Lupin a sort of an uncle figure- and he got so little family type love. Then he finally hugged Sirius that one time- and I was thinking "yes, hehe, he has family, and will have someone close to him, FINALLY!"... and then he dies...

AAARRRGGGGHH!! (sorry for the caps)

wow, lets just say I was frustrated. Frustrated times 20 billion! gagh...

why could he at least have had a little happy time with "father figure" Sirius before he died- most of the time they were so distant... *sigh* That's why he has to come back

I'm not sure what i think about lupin being a father figure-I would be so happy for Harry, but at the same time, I would be thinking "But DARNIT, that should be Sirius..."

:wah I want my lovely Sirius back *sniffle*...

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~Ms.E

Queen of the Fourth years

1st Year Joined: Jul 05, 2003 Posts: 83

YES! We saw Lupin and Harry grow closer throughout PoA and then he disappeared in GoF! (I kept wishing he'd show up again, even though we had Sirius-- I figured they'd live together and then Harry could join them later on.) Then the whole handshake business started in OotP and I actually said out loud at one point "Why do they keep doing that?" or something like that. I didn't notice Lupin specifically backing off so much, but in retrospect I think you're right. If Lupin "loves to be loved," he should be there for Harry. They really do need eachother. I hope they get Wormtail together! (WithOUT Lupin dying!!)

I forgot to ask-- I specifically remember being gratified by that one hug between Harry & Sirius, but I don't remember when it was. The Xmas holiday, right?

Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub39.ezboard.com/bsiriusblackfanclub.showUserPublicProfile?gid=thesquib>The Squib[/url] at: 7/6/03 9:08 pm

I

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forgot to ask-- I specifically remember being gratified by that one hug between Harry & Sirius, but I don't remember when it was. The Xmas holiday, right?

Yep, while Harry was staunchly refusing to think about that stupid gift/mirror. Argh! At least he got that last hug in...

Trace <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START blue paw

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1st Year Joined: Jul 07, 2003 Posts: 27

I�m so glad I came across this topic. Before reading this, I thought I was just being a stubborn girl refusing point-blank to accept the reality. Now I finally know what bothered me all along: precisely what you guys are saying.

maybe it�s a contradiction, but if Sirius and Harry had been closer in this book, or even Sirius and Remus, I�d have accepted his death more easily. It�d had given a sense of closure to the whole thing, bitter and at the same time sweet. But no, there was nothing, just a black hole. Nobody talked about really important stuff (actually, there was almost no emotionally strong scenes since PoA). The relationship just wasn�t there... that�s why Sirius� death was such a painful shock.

Did JK think she already used all the character� potential? Any MWPP fanfic has more emotion than OoPh in it...

Starshine

PS - MsSiriusWhite: just to tell you how much I agree with that "BOOK 5 NEVER HAPPENED" thing. If you happen to have a badge, let me know!

Post subject: Re: helped me sort my feelings Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2003 09:45 AM

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PS - MsSiriusWhite: just to tell you how much I agree with that "BOOK 5 NEVER HAPPENED" thing. If you happen to have a badge, let me know!

Our own VP, Mag, has made and offered that button (and more) for siggy use. You can find her link under the "HP Devo presents new buttons" thread.

Trace <!--EZCODE EMOTICON START blue paw

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Post subject: Re: helped me sort my feelings Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2003 01:15 PM

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Yep, while Harry was staunchly refusing to think about that stupid gift/mirror. Argh! At least he got that last hug in...

Too bad it was only a "brief, one armed hug." Not even a quality, I-love-you-like-a-son hug. Ahhhh, the frustration.

Post subject: Re: helped me sort my feelings Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2003 01:33 PM

Starshine- yes, it is on mag's site- you can click on the hp devotions site on the left side of the screen on this website, ot if you just click on the button, it also brings you to her website.

iluvsirius-

I know what was with the stupid one armed hug thing?

ggrrrrrr.....

hmmm... too bad there aren't any growling dog emoticons...

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~Ms.E

Queen of the Fourth years

1st Year Joined: Jun 25, 2003 Posts: 59

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Too bad it was only a "brief, one armed hug." Not even a quality, I-love-you-like-a-son hug

Yeah, I know >__<

I still loved that hug, though <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/ohwell.gif ALT=":]

And I wish Sirius and Harry had hugged a lot more..

But maybe.. after all those years alone in Azkaban, Sirius kind offorgot how to be affectionate, if you know what I mean.

Maybe he just wasn't used to affection, and that's why he only gave a brief, one-armed hug..

Post subject: Hugs... Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2003 04:20 PM

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But maybe.. after all those years alone in Azkaban, Sirius kind of forgot how to be affectionate, if you know what I mean.

Maybe he just wasn't used to affection, and that's why he only gave a brief, one-armed hug.

True enough, I've thought about that, but Sirius seems to have regressed in his "emotional development" or whatever you'd like to call it. In PoA, Sirius was a lot more affectionate (at the end, anyway), as was Lupin. I mean Sirius and Lupin hug in PoA for god sakes. If two grown men can hug, surely one of them can hug Harry. And even if that emotional scarring from Azkaban holds true for Sirius, what about Lupin? (Tormented werewolf syndrome?) Oh well...

Post subject: Re: Hugs... Posted: Mon Jul 07, 2003 05:07 PM

Hmm, I don't know maybe he didn't hug Harry for lack of affection but perhaps its because they are guys. Not to generalize or use stereotypes of any kind. But it was more of the hand shake and clap on the shoulder that were his signs of affection other than Mrs.Weasley who hugs more. That could be it? Charmgrl88

I don't think Sirius's lack of outward emotion toward Harry had anything to do with repressed feelings or the fact that they are males. I think he was beaten down mentally from having to live in his house which he despised so much that he left at the age of 16, his impotence at having to remain in the house while the other members of the Order were able to be more productive, and the constant needling from Snape. It is also possible that his inability to leave the house made him feel trapped like a prisoner, and the whole situation was reminiscent of Azkaban. He was frustrated and lonely and angry, and this showed in his interactions with other characters.

I think Sirius cared about Harry too much. Remember his disappointment when Harry's expulsion was overturned? Perhaps he realized then that he was becoming dependent upon Harry for happiness and his lack of physical emotion was his way of distancing himself. Maybe he was bracing himself against being hurt because look at the life he had had, nothing had ever worked out for him. *huge sob*

Maybe our beloved Sirius didn't hug Harry enough in OotP, but let's not forget, he sacrificed his own life when he thought Harry was in danger. It doesn't get much deeper than that.

Muggle Joined: Jul 09, 2003 Posts: 8

sblackfan i think you're so right! I think Sirius closed himself in this book...he spent more time with Bukbeak.....

I think there will be a much closer bond between Lupin and Harry now.