As many of you know I've been dancing under a 'Snape for the HBP' banner for a while now. However, someone made a comment on livejournal which, had I thought of it before I read the book, may have caused me to rethink - why would Snape call himself the Half-Blood Prince? (Yes, I know it sounds obvious but I hadn't thought about it from that perspective. I assumed that we were talking about a prince, a family heritage that could not be avoided, rather than a title that he would give to himself.)

So, after arriving at Hogwarts, Snape becomes one of the few half-bloods in Slytherin. "Said Slytherin, 'We'll teach just those whose ancestry is purest.' [...] For instance, Slytherin took only pure-blood wizards of great cunning, just like him." The Sorting Hat OotP Ch 11 He also becomes 'part of a gang of Slytherins who nearly all turned out to be Death Eaters.' GoF Ch 27 So why make up a name which dwells on his purity of blood if he's surrounded by prejudiced, pure-bloods? Surely, that's just asking for trouble.

Could it be that the teenage Snape was already drawing strength from comparing himself to one Lord Voldemort? Not only did they both have Muggle fathers but they were both extremely talented wizards. Snape, lets not forget, 'knew more curses when he arrived at school than half the kids in seventh year' GoF Ch 27 and, by the time he was 16, was rewriting his Advanced Potions textbook and actually inventing spells.

In creating the name 'Half-Blood Prince' then, was he making sure that everyone knew that he had a similar background to Lord Voldemort? Or perhaps he was merely rubbing it in that he was a better wizard than many of the pure-bloods. Would his friends have been aware of his 'title'? And did Lord Voldemort ever know that Snape outranked him?

His mother was a pure blood witch with the last name Prince. He was saying he half a Prince meaning his mothers side. I think he was really trying to denounce his fathers name and his own as his father was a muggle and Snape hated muggles.

Dark-Mark, I assure you I have read the book and I note Hermione's explanation that he must have been proud of being half a Prince. But really Tom Riddle denied his entire Muggle heritage whereas Snape proudly wore the title half-blood. Therefore, my point was by using the words half-blood was he trying to create a connection in people's minds between himself and Voldemort.

I agree that it seems odd that a proud Slytherin would go around parading the fact that he's not a pureblood, especially one that goes around slinging the word 'mudblood' around at people - which would seem to indicate that he cares about that sort of thing quite a bit.

Drawing attention to his similarities with Voldemort is certainly a plausible explanation for that, but I wonder how many of LVs followers actually know of his family history? It seemed to me (though I may be mistaken) that Dumbledore had to go to great lenths to get even the small memories that he had regarding Tom Riddle's history, so perhaps, especially before Lord Voldemort came out of the "I'm Really Evil" closet (like back in Snape's school days) it wasn't a well known fact who Voldemort was or how he grew up.

It occurs to me as well that there might be a completely different reason that Snape would adopt the name. Assuming (as I do) that Snape hasn't really betrayed the Order, that he was operating under Dumbledore's instructions, perhaps he was secretly proud of his heritage. Maybe it was something he wouldn't admit to even himself, but if he was good enough to eventually join Dumbledore, it could follow that growing up he had some doubts about the whole purity of blood issue, and that he adopted the name only for himself, with none of his classmates knowing about it. A secret pride in his ancestry, depite it not conforming with his house's values.

ife

*dances with Moon under banner*

Dark-Mark, I believe the point Moon was making was that Snape was outing his HALF-BLOOD status in a housefull of fellow Slytherins, and why he chose to do so. We all know about the mother's name, since JKR told us.

ANYWAY ~

This also adds fodder to the 'why does LV 'trust' Snape so much?' Not only is Snape clearly gifted in the Dark Arts, but he dares to rub other's faces in his heritage by writing in his textbook this way.

LV would have a vested interest in keeping such a powerful wizard on his side. Snape himself tells Bellatrix:

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The Dark Lord's initial displeasure at my lateness vanished entirely, I assure you, when I explained that I remained faithful, though Dumbledore thought I was his man. Yes, the Dark Lord thought that I had left him forever, but he was wrong.

HBP, Spinner's End.

This information regarding Snape's forgivness flies in the face of everything we know about Voldemort. The Dark Lord does not forgive the most minor transgression, and yet he is willing to hear Snape out. Pettigrew handed Voldemort the Potter's, and yet he was afraid the Dark Lord would kill him for desertion unless he did something as spectacular as hand over Potter to him. (POA - The Servant of Lord Voldemort)

It would seem LV perfers to kill first and asks questions later. So what makes Snape the exception to the rule?

moonanddogstar wrote:

So why make up a name which dwells on his purity of blood if he's surrounded by prejudiced, pure-bloods? Surely, that's just asking for trouble. Could it be that the teenage Snape was already drawing strength from comparing himself to one Lord Voldemort? In creating the name 'Half-Blood Prince' then, was he making sure that everyone knew that he had a similar background to Lord Voldemort? Or perhaps he was merely rubbing it in that he was a better wizard than many of the pure-bloods. Would his friends have been aware of his 'title'? And did Lord Voldemort ever know that Snape outranked him?

Wow Moon - that's food for thought.

In the context of the times - the peace/love generation that was in Hogwarts at the time that Snape was (which was the same time I was in secondary school), I don't know how much overt prejudice Snape would be taking.

If he was ashamed of his background, I seriously doubt that he would give his housemates any ammunition to taunt him with. Nor do I think that he would be the type to share his text book with his annoted potions recipes or his self-created title of Prince. Can you imagine the additional grief he would have received from the Marauders if James or Sirius were aware he was referring to himself as a Prince?! I can imagine that his notes were a closely guarded secret. Maybe he even put a thieve's curse on the book to protect it from curious eyes while he was still at school.

I also don't believe there is any way that Snape would dare to show Voldemort the level of his ambition by styling himself Prince, outranking Lord V. That is one of the reasons that I think that Snape may have been plotting to overthrow Voldemort himself if the opportunity arose, or throw his support behind Harry, if Harry proved to be a dark wizard as well.

aoife I agree it was most likely a secret. But, going by Half-Blood meaning magical and not prince, I’m wondering if he wasn't trying to connect himself with Voldemort, but separate himself from him. Privately. Neither really had friends and were similar so much in that they were different from everyone else, maybe Snape wanted to be different even from Voldemort, though to much of a coward to use the name publicly.

This is a bit of a tangent, but while we are on the subject of Snape and Lord Voldemort:

LV and Snape seem to have numerous similarities. Further, Snape seems to be the most powerful of his followers. In fact, in the scene in Spinner's end where Narcissa and Bellatrix are comming to see Snape, you get a feeling almost like they are going to see a Prince. He does treat Wormtail as a servant, and the way that Bella and Narcissa refer to him seems almost, almost like they are speaking to LV(except for when Bella godes Snape). So, perhaps Snape is a lot more powerful than we suspect?

I agree it was probably a secret. In fact, is it likely that both the HBP and LV came up with their names together, at the same time?

One last question that I am pondering: Does Snape have a Horcrux? Certainly, if he was LV's right hand man, he would have had a better chance than any to find out how to create one.

Any thoughts?

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It would seem LV perfers to kill first and asks questions later. So what makes Snape the exception to the rule?

Pincey I may have an answer. I think the prince in HBP has many meanings. One is that he is a half-blood because of his parents so he took the name Half-Blood Prince Prince being his mothers last name. We all know that. The other being that LORD Voldemort might have only trusted Snape out of all of the DE. So Snape might have taken the name Half-Blood Prince. But I dont see how my second theory works as Snape took the name while he was in Hogwarts before he became a DE. But maybe since he had heard of Voldemort he could have been so intrigued he researched Voldemort religiously and found out that Vodlemort to was a Half-Blood. SO if Voldemort was LORD then he was the Prince. Confusing...

Actually, I think the reverse of that theory may be true. I don't think Snape ever used the name, Half-Blood Prince, with Voldemort's group. I think he kept it a secret from them.

I think it was a nickname Lily gave him.

Notice how Slughorn keeps saying that Harry's potion skill is just like his mothers, and yet all the tips are coming from Snape's book.

I think Snape tutored Lily in potions, and that's where they became friends (though Snape loved her). Such good friends, that Snape admitted his deepest secret to the "mudblood" that he was only a wizard on his Prince family side. To which, I could easily hear Lily saying with a smile, "Severus Snape, the Half-Blood Prince."

Thus, it becomes a secret shared between them. A secret written in a book that Snape tosses away to be left at Hogwarts because he feels rejected when Lily ends up with James.

First - let me say great topic. Now on the subject at hand.

We know that Snape has always been fascinated with the Dark Arts. As for using the name Half Blood Prince, I think he did sort of take a page out of LV's book. We know that LV took the name to not only get away from his Muggle heritage but to create a name that would bring fear to the hearts of the people who heard it. There are not many who knew that LV was not pure blood, even his closest supporters did not know. So then, why bring this out? Here what I am thinking.

I think Snape craved the same sort of infamy LV was gaining. Snape sought power and recognition, and creating a nickname can do just that. The person becomes more than a person - a larger than life caricature or a sort of legend. But I do not think that he took HBP to draw attention to his heritage. I thik he took the name to create a bond with someone he admired. Clearly Snape was not the most popular of kids at Hogwarts and maybe creating this name for himself was a way of gaining the acceptance he was otherwise denied.

But there could be more. LV wanted to get away from his Muggle past, yet marks Harry for that very reason. I believe Snape was, in essence, marking himself equal as well. I think Snape, while as of yet unaware of a Harry Potter future, was trying to equate himself to Tom Riddle.

As with most things in life, people vilify that which they do not understand or fear. While the talk is that pure-bloods do not view half-bloods or others as worthy - I think that, in a way - they also fear the power that they can possess. LV thought the non-pure blood to be the bigger threat. After all, it seems that some of the smartest and most powerful wizards and witches are not, in fact the pure-bloods but those of varied backgrounds. That being said, I think Snape may have chosen HBP as an almost ironic moniker. Showing people that he is even more powerful because he has this in his background - he has "overcome" in a way.

Of course - we do not know that Snape even referred to himself as the Half Blood Blood to anyone other than his book. We do not know that he actually said - “Hey guys, by the way, I am the Half Blood Prince”. And when I think about this, I cannot imagine why he would create such a name. Why write it in a book, develop such spells and then leave the book behind. I can only theorize that he wanted some sort of legacy, or again, the same kind of infamy as LV. It could even be possible that LV knew of the book and the spells and asked that it be left behind - kind of like another sort of diary.

I hope I am making some kind of sense here. After all, I am still dealing with the death of Dumbledore. I feel a bit Befuddled.

Serious

Truthfully_aBlack wrote:

I think Snape tutored Lily in potions...

How do we know that Lily didn't instead tutor Snape in potions?

Curses and hexes aside. Hermione seems to be more skilled in potions than the boys her year. Lily could have been just the same.

Truthfully_aBlack wrote:

Actually, I think the reverse of that theory may be true. I don't think Snape ever used the name, Half-Blood Prince, with Voldemort's group. I think he kept it a secret from them. I think it was a nickname Lily gave him. Notice how Slughorn keeps saying that Harry's potion skill is just like his mothers, and yet all the tips are coming from Snape's book. I think Snape tutored Lily in potions, and that's where they became friends (though Snape loved her). Such good friends, that Snape admitted his deepest secret to the "mudblood" that he was only a wizard on his Prince family side. To which, I could easily hear Lily saying with a smile, "Severus Snape, the Half-Blood Prince." Thus, it becomes a secret shared between them. A secret written in a book that Snape tosses away to be left at Hogwarts because he feels rejected when Lily ends up with James.

Thats a really good theory. Kudos to you. Sounds logical too. Just read Pinceys. Thats true. I think Lily hated Snape once he called here a mud-blood in OotP Chapter: Snapes worst Memory. Then Lily said something like forget you Snivellus. And James got pissed. And Lily was a pity you or something.

I absolutely agree with that theory. If Lily had given Snape the name, he would have kept it secret and not told his fellow Slyherins. So Hermione got it right: he doesn't want to associate himself to the book, that's why he has tolet Harry keep it.
I always wondered why Snape's Worst Memory would have been his worst. Maybe it is because he insulted Lily and called her mudblood even though she knew he wasn't a pureblood either. Lily seemed rather taken aback by his words.
What do you think?

exactly. they must have been really good friends secretly. Snape must have loved having her as a friend as he was not to popular himself and she was. It was their secret. Then in Snape Worst Memory James, Sirius, Lupin, started to do the levicorpus and such on Snivellus. Lily comes along and tell them to stop and James stops. Then Snape, maybe feeling that he didnt need help from a girl especially a mud-blood in his anger to not be able to do anything for himself let the worl mud-lood slip out of his mouth at Lily. This was most likely the end of their friendship. If Snape never caled her a mud-blood things might have turned out differently maybe. With snape never become a DE, and he never telling LV the prophecy. IT COULD BEEN DIFFERENT!!!!!!!! *CRY*